What Has happened To TV Audio?

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lastone
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What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by lastone » Wed Nov 18, 2009 2:14 pm

TV audio wasn't so bad. Then "Digital" came along and....DAMNNNNN!!!! The audio has gone to hell!
My old TV has AGC, so I turned it off to see what was going on. Big mistake, From a whisper on ch3 to screaming on ch13 and ch29....well that's another story. Does anyone there know what a VU meter is for? You can't even watch the cartoons on 29.2 for the audio is in and out. The picture breaks up on rapid scene changes too. Thanks to "Digital" I now have to be constantly adjusting the volume.

Why torture viewers like this?
http://www.thenewoldiesshow.com
WRSG Knights 91.5 Middlebourne-Sistersville, WV 5 PM Eastern Wednesdays (Repeats 7 AM Thursdays).
106.3 The Double Q, Farmington, Iowa, 10-11 AM Central time, Wednesdays.
Buckeye Broadcasting, Cambridge, Ohio, 10 AM Eastern time Friday and other days on Live 365.com
WBPS 101.9, Cambridge, Ohio
KZBZ 92.1, Williams, Arizona,
Sundays.

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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by genlock » Wed Nov 18, 2009 2:33 pm

The old +4 is now -20.
Not a problem unless your plant is hybrid with some digital and some analog.
Remove an analog deck and plug in a digital, you must adjust levels on the deck.
Most everything has a VU meter instead of a real level meter so go with zero VU.
It is kind of a problem with DA's and routing switchers if more than one
screwdriver guy exists. I would guess that WSAZ has it correct.
On a channel that has high or hot audio, listen for distortion as the audio
exceeds the digital limits. Also in analog, silence is nothing.
In digital, silence has a value and to be really silent, you must meet that value.
Same with black, used to be sync and setup(or black w/ burst), not any more.
Now you need a digital black source, properly set up to comply.
They even changed the value of setup. Was 7.5% now 10%.
Takes time for dinosaurs to adapt.
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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by oldtvman2 » Wed Nov 18, 2009 4:55 pm

in TV audio was always the step child. the picture was it. now there is nobody riding audio as in the past. the audio on spots are always high. this is to wake up the people who are asleep or have went out of the room when a break comes on so they can hear. but mostly the picture is still king with audio still not wanted. when a song comes on the music is always louder that the singer i guess because songs no longer tell stories, and you can't understand the words any way. another thing i can't understand is why the weather is more important that someone getting shot or a fire ? one can just look out the door or window and see what it is but the stations think it is the most important.
REV. ED

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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by genlock » Wed Nov 18, 2009 5:48 pm

Cause weather is cheap. WX persons are generally paid less than anchors.
Anchors need to know more words. Weather people know maybe 500 total words and phrases.
Listen sometime to the weather report and see if the same sentence is used in the same place every day.
The weather center gear is already there. Nothing more to buy.
Consultants have said people watch the weather.
Stations do not generally piss anyone off with the weather.
You can repeat the same weather over and over during the newscast.
For some reason viewers do not object to this.
No expensive reporters or news vehicles are required for the weather.
You must, however, try to name obscure towns in the coverage area on the weather displays.
And point them out.
Do not mis-pronounce names of local towns. To this end weather-casters will emphasize those towns
in the weather cast. Tony always talks about the Zaleski national forest.
Chauncey in Logan County is pronounced differently than Chauncey in Athens County.
Viewers are happy when they hear their town's name on the air and
It has nothing to to with Meth, murder or incest.
Weather-casters do not need talent or training, they need to be pleasant.
That makes them cheaper.

Cheaper.
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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by Big Media » Thu Nov 19, 2009 9:46 am

With the digital sub channels, the audio is likely not routed through any type of compressor/limiter as it often is with the digital main channel. This is because the audio and video are combined in the ASI stream and piped directly into the exciter.

The biggest issue I have is with lip sync. I was trying to watch WOWK over the weekend and it was just unwatchable. The audio was ahead by almost a full second.

There just shouldn't be any excuses, here. The industry needs a solution for this problem.

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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by fearpeddler » Thu Nov 19, 2009 9:48 am

some models of DVC deck have improper meters also, alot of them -40 = 0 ......
Doesn't MSNBC stand for the Media that Spins the News for Barrack's Cabinet?



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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by genlock » Thu Nov 19, 2009 9:58 am

fearpeddler wrote:some models of DVC deck have improper meters also, alot of them -40 = 0 ......
Wonderful.


As for the lip sync. It is possible to cure the problem with the turn of a knob.
TBC/synchronizers exist that do that very job (and more).
Management must care enough to buy one.
Operators must care enough to make the adjustment.
Problems exist like this in a hybrid plant and must have attention paid to them.

I bet a call directly to WOWK explaining the problem would solve things.
Ask for Bray Cary.
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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by fearpeddler » Thu Nov 19, 2009 10:17 am

the sync problem is a hardware issue starting to plague stations in mid-conversion all over the place, too many manufacturers making cheap crap.
Doesn't MSNBC stand for the Media that Spins the News for Barrack's Cabinet?



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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by engineer » Thu Nov 19, 2009 1:49 pm

Disclaimer: Not a TV guy, but I can tell that some channels process the hell out of the audio. You can tell by routing your sound through a VU or dBfs meter. When the meter hardly moves because of the density, there is heavy processing somewhere, or someone adding some DC to the mix :lol: I do agree, to my ears the TV audio has gone to crap, and radio audio has been crap for many years. Most radio equipment with analog and AES works out to be +4 = -12dBfs or something close, but no guarantee :evil:

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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by fearpeddler » Thu Nov 19, 2009 2:27 pm

as stations get away from analog equipment we'll see these problems go away
Doesn't MSNBC stand for the Media that Spins the News for Barrack's Cabinet?



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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by genlock » Thu Nov 19, 2009 2:33 pm

fearpeddler wrote:as stations get away from analog equipment we'll see these problems go away

Any guess about the time frame for WOAY-TV?
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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by sportsvoice » Thu Nov 19, 2009 9:02 pm

Speaking of annoying TV audio, NFL network commercials are about twice as loud as the game audio tonight.

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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by AmpedNow » Thu Nov 19, 2009 9:20 pm

sportsvoice wrote:Speaking of annoying TV audio, NFL network commercials are about twice as loud as the game audio tonight.
Suddenlink's local spots are loud to the point of distortion.

They seem to be placed randomly among the channels, too.

These have to generate more complaints than sales. Have they not realized that jarring people trying to relax in their recliners with loud commercials just pisses people off to the point that they don't take notice of what's being advertised, but they just grit their teeth until it's over with?

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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by Greg Goodfellow » Thu Nov 19, 2009 10:33 pm

genlock wrote:
fearpeddler wrote:as stations get away from analog equipment we'll see these problems go away

Any guess about the time frame for WOAY-TV?
Approximately the 12th of never.
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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by genlock » Fri Nov 20, 2009 6:28 am

AmpedNow wrote:
sportsvoice wrote:Speaking of annoying TV audio, NFL network commercials are about twice as loud as the game audio tonight.
Suddenlink's local spots are loud to the point of distortion.

Yet when Suddenlink runs Dragnet or Racket Squad or Horror movies, their audio is very low.
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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by Clay JD Walker » Sun Nov 22, 2009 8:04 pm

Ya know, transmission aside, what in the hell is the deal with speakers on new tvs?! It's like some sort of Best Buy conspiracy to make you buy a surround sound system (which I detest). I finally broke down and bought a 32 inch LCD yesterday between remotes...sure, I'm cheap and bought the 299 dynex from BB (because months ago, something happened to my 5 year old 26 inch HD CRT set's audio on the component input). Ya know, my Blackberry has better audio on it than this TV. Yes, it's a small TV, yes it's very cheap, but I haven't found great audio on a flat screen yet. Now, I'm back to square one...my old Kenwood receiver from 1975 and the Advent speakers hooked up to the DirecTV, and my lard ass getting up to cut it down every time commercials come on.

And I learned something...1080i sucks in comparison that 720p...and no, Directv doesn't pass 1080p...so the cheapy looks great, sounds like wet poop.

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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by fearpeddler » Sun Nov 22, 2009 8:11 pm

i dunno, 1080i and 720p look about the same to me, now 1080p, theres a resolution!!! Out of the satelite providers dish whoops the crap outa direct tv for hd picture quality....
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Re: What Has happened To TV Audio?

Post by Clay JD Walker » Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:17 pm

Lucky for me, my eyes suck from years of staring at computer screens. I don't bluray yet, so that's not an issue. No time for xbox, so again, no issue. Locals are pushing a variety down here in the Directv, so after weighing my options, and wallet, I'll be fine with the cheap-o...unless it burns out in the next 3-6 months, then I'll be pissed.

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