Hit the road, Jack

Lester · Post by **Lester** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 2:47 pm

Way to capitalize on some classic calls.

I'm stunned.

304live · Post by **304live** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 2:56 pm

so whats the difference between V100, 100.9 and 107.3?

ive been switching back and forth between the three all day and i cant tell the difference at all..... 70's rock and 80's music mixed with a little 90's music...

Dave Harman · Post by **Dave Harman** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 3:18 pm

Local announcer, playlist, and new jingle package on the air now.

Arp2 · Post by **Arp2** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 3:36 pm

304live wrote:so whats the difference between V100, 100.9 and 107.3?

ive been switching back and forth between the three all day and i cant tell the difference at all..... 70's rock and 80's music mixed with a little 90's music...

That's okay....the rest of us think hip hop, rap, and urban all sound the same and can't tell the differences among them.

304live · Post by **304live** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 3:44 pm

so what is the difference now that you got that off your chest....

WVSportsDude · Post by **WVSportsDude** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 6:57 pm

I like the sound much better than Jack.

But they need more local jocks.

And lose "Puff the Magic Dragon."

Hoosier Daddy · Post by **Hoosier Daddy** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 8:52 pm

I'm really excited to hear WKAZ when I'm in the Charleston area again. The Top 40 sound should be a huge hit in Charleston if executed properly. It sounds like 107.3 is getting close to my *Ultimate Oldies* format ... you know, the one I'd construct and execute flawlessly if I ever had a chance ...

[rant mode=ON]

Most traditional Oldies stations are too clean and sanitary. Canned, worn out ("Good Tiiiiimes and Great Ollllldies!!!") liners. The same five PAMS "Drake" jingles heard ad nauseum on every Oldies outlet from Portland to Puerto Rico. And a narrow playlist of safe, focus group tested 40 year old songs everyone is sick of hearing.

And then there's the audio chain.

That's where the handful of stations who get the playlist correct go off track and botch it up: The station doesn't and can't recreate that bigger-than-life sound of the Top 40 giants back in the day. You need depth, and compression, and reverb -- in appropriate amounts, of course. Most Oldies stations, especially on FM, set the Optimod like they've got a second string A/C playing Melissa Ethridge. See Huntington's B97 if you have any questions about that.

True Top 40 stations back in the day had audio processing that made the records sound *better* that anything you could ever hope to hear at home. And the jocks didn't sound middle aged and dull -- like most Oldies jocks today. They were young and full of energy. Now, I understand, most young'uns in the biz are more likely to get excited about some Urban hip-hop mix or J-Lo, and I understand the coolness of "bringing back" a DJ legend from back in the day. But most Oldies DJs (the sat fed stuff is the worst) talk up the songs like it's some saturday morning mall-walking ElderCare remote hosted by Kentucky whats-his-name ...

Stop it. Immediately.

So ... expand the playlist a bit, keep it mainly uptempo, throw in a few measured "oh wow!" tunes in carefully controlled places, get the full range of PAMS stuff from back in the day (some of the Sonovox stuff is just way cool) and QUIT CALLING IT OLDIES!

The term "Oldies" has become the Beautiful Music or MOR death-label of the 21st century radio formats. I really like anything that emphasizes "Top 40" in the name. If you're looking at syndicated products, Tom Kent is superb Top 40 programming, as is Little Walter's Time Machine. Both should be "must carrys" for any authentic Top 40 station. Let the audience hear those guys (both of them still have 'it') before they're all too old and gone.

If you're up for a taste of someone who is sooooo close to doing it right, check out:

http://www.1650oldiesradio.com

It's a hobby station built by an old radio guy who did it just for fun. Essentially, 1650 is an internet station that also feeds a Part 15 AM transmitter at his house in North Dallas. The processing is spot-on and in beautiful mono. Reverb. Compression. And processing that'll suck the chrome off a trailer hitch. You'll even hear a top-of-the-hour electronic time tone syncronized with WWV. No DJs, but lots of "back in the day" commercials. A fun net station to hear! I hope this guy stays around for a while.

[/oldies rant]

So there you go. I need a cigarette.

Uncle Shishkabob · Post by **Uncle Shishkabob** » Mon Mar 19, 2007 10:18 pm

Amen brother...my kind of station. By the way I just returned from Myrtle Beach this weekend and it was good to hear Charlie Van Dyke liners on Sunny 106. The rest of the station sounded flat, boaring and dull, but the liners sounded good. ( Oh yes and TK from 7-Midnight sounded good)

Long live reverb,processing, jocks that want to have fun with it and a ton of good music. ROCK ON KAZ! Next time I'm heading south on I-77 I'll defenatly crank it up!

Arp2 · Post by **Arp2** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 1:32 am

304live wrote:so what is the difference now that you got that off your chest....

Got it off my chest?

I would imagine someone in-market who has heard them all recently can give you a better answer than I can. I'm sure the targets are different, resulting in fairly easily-noted differences in tempo, texture, topics, and so on and somewhat noticable differences in eras and artists.

I know Tom Kent's "Classic Top 40" is more of a "Male(-leaning), gold-based Bright AC" than an "oldies," and I'm pretty confident V-100 is still a female-leaning, gold-based AC...I'm not sure I've heard your "Mix" in its current formulation, so I don't know how it fits in the...."mix."

Cameron · Post by **Cameron** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 10:40 am

Hoosier Daddy wrote:I'm really excited to hear WKAZ when I'm in the Charleston area again. The Top 40 sound should be a huge hit in Charleston if executed properly. It sounds like 107.3 is getting close to my *Ultimate Oldies* format ... you know, the one I'd construct and execute flawlessly if I ever had a chance ...

[rant mode=ON]

Most traditional Oldies stations are too clean and sanitary. Canned, worn out ("Good Tiiiiimes and Great Ollllldies!!!") liners. The same five PAMS "Drake" jingles heard ad nauseum on every Oldies outlet from Portland to Puerto Rico. And a narrow playlist of safe, focus group tested 40 year old songs everyone is sick of hearing.

And then there's the audio chain.

That's where the handful of stations who get the playlist correct go off track and botch it up: The station doesn't and can't recreate that bigger-than-life sound of the Top 40 giants back in the day. You need depth, and compression, and reverb -- in appropriate amounts, of course. Most Oldies stations, especially on FM, set the Optimod like they've got a second string A/C playing Melissa Ethridge. See Huntington's B97 if you have any questions about that.

True Top 40 stations back in the day had audio processing that made the records sound *better* that anything you could ever hope to hear at home. And the jocks didn't sound middle aged and dull -- like most Oldies jocks today. They were young and full of energy. Now, I understand, most young'uns in the biz are more likely to get excited about some Urban hip-hop mix or J-Lo, and I understand the coolness of "bringing back" a DJ legend from back in the day. But most Oldies DJs (the sat fed stuff is the worst) talk up the songs like it's some saturday morning mall-walking ElderCare remote hosted by Kentucky whats-his-name ...

Stop it. Immediately.

So ... expand the playlist a bit, keep it mainly uptempo, throw in a few measured "oh wow!" tunes in carefully controlled places, get the full range of PAMS stuff from back in the day (some of the Sonovox stuff is just way cool) and QUIT CALLING IT OLDIES!

The term "Oldies" has become the Beautiful Music or MOR death-label of the 21st century radio formats. I really like anything that emphasizes "Top 40" in the name. If you're looking at syndicated products, Tom Kent is superb Top 40 programming, as is Little Walter's Time Machine. Both should be "must carrys" for any authentic Top 40 station. Let the audience hear those guys (both of them still have 'it') before they're all too old and gone.

If you're up for a taste of someone who is sooooo close to doing it right, check out:

http://www.1650oldiesradio.com

It's a hobby station built by an old radio guy who did it just for fun. Essentially, 1650 is an internet station that also feeds a Part 15 AM transmitter at his house in North Dallas. The processing is spot-on and in beautiful mono. Reverb. Compression. And processing that'll suck the chrome off a trailer hitch. You'll even hear a top-of-the-hour electronic time tone syncronized with WWV. No DJs, but lots of "back in the day" commercials. A fun net station to hear! I hope this guy stays around for a while.

[/oldies rant]

So there you go. I need a cigarette.

The audio stream sounds overdriven on some of the songs. I'm sure the MPEG compression isn't doing it any justice, either.
We'd get a better idea of the sound at something above 22kbps.
I guess this "just for fun" station will get squeezed-out by the new copyright decision, anyway.

304live · Post by **304live** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 11:58 am

ive listened several more times today....

what i cant figure out is how these stations differentiate themselves from each other.... do 3 stations really need to exist in this market that serve the same basic purpose? (that arent country) they all are going after about 80% the same people and its not even the largest segment... one might lean a little bit more this or a little bit more that but the core audience seems to be the same people... am i wrong?

are V100 and KAZ really going to have a different enough core group of listeners that they arent going to cannabilize each other?

is the charleston market large enough to have 3 stations succede at this style of station?

if the market ISNT large enough.... what is going to be the deciding factor that makes the 1 or 2 stick around?

Big Media · Post by **Big Media** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 12:07 pm

304live wrote:are V100 and KAZ really going to have a different enough core group of listeners that they arent going to cannabilize each other?

You may have a point here but it does keep Bristol and LM from launching the oldies plattform, which we already know based on KAZ's previous oldies ratings, would be a good switch for an under performer like MIX or WQBE.

er uh, Z-Rock..

Could you imagine? Oldies on WQBE?

Lester · Post by **Lester** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 1:40 pm

304live wrote:what i cant figure out is how these stations differentiate themselves from each other.... do 3 stations really need to exist in this market that serve the same basic purpose? (that arent country) they all are going after about 80% the same people and its not even the largest segment... one might lean a little bit more this or a little bit more that but the core audience seems to be the same people... am i wrong?

We've got the same issue down here. Y102.9 (Oldies), 100.7 (Classic Hits), 96.1 (Everything that rocks), and 101.5 (Hot AC) have a criminal amount of playlist crossover. Yet we can't get a new/modern/alt rock station.

Dave Allen · Post by **Dave Allen** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 1:48 pm

At least with V100 you are getting some 90s/current music,which you won't get at all with107.3 Its just one guy but I was talking with one older gentlemen who was a huge fan of the oldies 1073. (his age upper 50's). I know that's probably way outside the target demo but he doesn't like the new format. He does like it much better than Jack, though. He pointed to Blue Oyster Cult/Don't Fear the Reaper, Van Halen/Dance the Night Away and a few more "rockers" as he called it as reasons he doesn't like the new 107.3. Just one guy though, and an older one at that.

Arp2 · Post by **Arp2** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 2:33 pm

Hoosier Daddy wrote:Most traditional Oldies stations are too clean and sanitary.

They're a combination of how people use them and how they say they want them to be.

Canned, worn out ("Good Tiiiiimes and Great Ollllldies!!!") liners.

Those liners exist because they're reflecting back to the audience what it has said it wants based on why it's coming to the station.

And a narrow playlist...

...a playlist that gives the listener what he or she wants from the station -- a quick fix of feel-good songs and good memories.

...of safe,...

"...of favorite..."

...focus group tested...

Who would test a library of songs on a focus group???? The sample would be absurdly small and unreliable.

Learn it: Libraries of songs are never tested on focus groups.

By believing what they read on the internet, many people are actually getting dumber rather than smarter. If you read it on the internet and it has come from some "Average Joe," assume it to be false. Even if the "Average Joe" "sounds" or "seems" somehow official or credentialed. Heck,....(insert PutnamLive joke here)....

Does anybody read those radio Usenet groups? What....does someone actually believe anything that Tom Hendricks guy says??

...40 year old songs...

Isn't that what "oldies" is? "Oldies" fanatics always scream "50s and 60s!" That's now 40-50 years ago.

Man....

...everyone is sick of hearing.

If "everyone" were sick of hearing the songs, that would show up as 100% "burn" on the music tests. In reality, in a more controlled environment, it's unusual to see more than ~15% on the worst (internet testing often comes back higher).

And then there's the audio chain.

...which sounds better than it ever has on those songs!

Hoosier Daddy · Post by **Hoosier Daddy** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 3:14 pm

You don't get it Arp.

You are Mister Corporate Bland Radio Programmer, and are part of the problem.

Sorry.

Arp2 · Post by **Arp2** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 3:20 pm

Oh.....okay.....sorry for bothering you.

Carry on.

Hoosier Daddy · Post by **Hoosier Daddy** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 3:29 pm

Bob Campbell · Post by **Bob Campbell** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 4:16 pm

Actually, music libraries are tested at focus groups. Geez, I hope that's what we paid for.
But most of what Arp says rings true. And the upper 50's guy is way out of the demo. Like I said earlier, they're probably trying for a demo about 5-8 years younger than the previous incarnation of Oldies. That means no 50's and some 80's. But Blue Oyster Cult seems way hard for the format. Even though it was a top 40 hit.Hmmm...maybe I should add it.....

Dave Allen · Post by **Dave Allen** » Tue Mar 20, 2007 4:40 pm

Yeah I knew he was..I just thought it was an interesting thought.